March 28th, 2023 Livestream

TSR / FXAA

https://youtube.com/embed/oLl9SZht-bE?autoplay=1&start=3151&end=3873

Transcript

cool let's move on, and talk about TSR maybe we'll have time to have like a fully owned quick section but, I'll do my best we have so much to cover so TSR temporal, sampling resolution or super resolution I can't remember it's there's another upsampling technique that has a similar name but I think it's temporal's super resolution and I gotta check it, yeah super resolution so we'll talk about TSR which is temporal super resolution let's talk about FXAA which is a like, it's another anti-aliasing technique there's gonna be like four I think or three, different anti-aliasing techniques available in the game JS mentioned in the video I'm trying to find the notes here, foreign it's not in the notes that's annoying but yeah TSR tscr is used for being able to render lower like resolution and scale it up it's it's been historically very useful for when you're rendering the game in 4k because 4K is a lot more screen space than, then, then then regular 1080p, so it's been really useful but it's also useful even if you don't have like a machine that can render 1080 like you can still down scale it and scale it up typically these type of scaling techniques are usually better when you go like the higher the like the the higher the base value of a resolution obviously the better the final output is going to be so for instance when you're rendering from 1080 to 4K or 14 not 4K but the one before 1440p, when you're going from 1080 to 1440p usually the result is better than when you go from 720 to 1080 if that makes sense like because if the amount of the pixels and the way those techniques work, so it's like it's more useful for people when you're rendering from 1080 to 4K rather than going for like 720 to 1080. typically like in terms of fidelity of what you're looking at but it's still a really powerful technique, now one thing the kind of elephant I want to address in the room, that's kind of strange is historically I've already seen a couple of questions about dlss and I also want to mention, what's it FSR amd's version a lot of people asked us in the past if we're going to do dlss and FSR and in the past we've often said that we probably won't because we didn't see a significant improvements like we didn't see any significant Improvement when using dlss or FSR, with our game, but with TSR we are seeing that Improvement which is kind of strange and I don't really have a good answer as to why that is, there might be a couple of factors and maybe we if we test out dlss now maybe we'll we'll notice a better gain but the thing is you sort of have to, adjust your game based on these techniques because they work in very different ways TSR and dlss are they achieve the same thing but under the hood they work very differently dlss, has an issue as well where I believe it can bottleneck your CPU so that might be why we're seeing a difference in performance when using the LSS versus the TSR I don't know, I try to dig into like why we would be seeing that and I couldn't really get a like a consistent answer, but there was something about how dlss like if dlss can catch up it will bottleneck your CPU which will create this like a weird what you call it like Mexican standoff no, whereas TSR is a lot more like it's a lot easier on the CPU than dlss and FSR is, so out of the different techniques we found that TSR works the best I know that at least from my experience that I find that dlss is a bit better quality wise I think if you compare the two, but tscr is more performant it seems, and it's more lightweight on the CPU what it needs to do, so that's one aspect the other aspect like I mentioned here is that, you sort of have to they are two different techniques so you sort of have to like do a little bit of, special thing in the game to make them look good as well so one issue we had when we were testing out dlss was that all moving Parts all moving Factory Parts looked like garbage on dlss, so like all the arms animating when they're like you know moving and doing stuff on the factories all the stuff moving on the belts like that was completely broken as far as I know and it was a lot less work to get it working with TSR than it is to get it working with dlss, so I don't know if like in the future we're going to be supporting dlss or FSR but I think at the moment we're still not going to support the LSS or FSR because TSR kind of fills that Gap that a lot of people are after also TSR is supported on more gpus than both the LSS and FSR I know that dlss has gone back in in like being able to support older gpus because when we started looking into dlss it was like, it was only supported on

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I can't remember when the later GTX like cards and there was such a small percentage of our player base that had like that could support dlss, so so it didn't really make much sense for us, whereas TSR is supported on all the cards that we support essentially I believe, epic adding native DLS support so I believe that's TSR I don't believe epic are adding native dls's support to real engine, because they made TSR I think they kind of like they kind of chose to go that route instead it is possible that they might like there is dls's support it's just you have to use a plug-in and I don't know if that's natively supported by unreal whereas TSR is natively supported like out of the box, it was not a tick box before no it was you actually had to import the plugin and stuff like that, so that's why we're going to ZR TSR I don't know if we're going to use dlss or FSR in the future, because we also need to put the network and we'd rather put in the work and other stuff and if you want to use those techniques CSR is there for you

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, but we'll see we'll see, what else was there about this yeah, I can't remember what FXAA if it's just fidelity entailancing but it's it's it's like a faster entailancing technique and I'm actually quite surprised of how good it looks, I honestly prefer FXAA over TSR in a lot of cases but I'm testing it out, so I think yeah thank you fast approximate anti-lasing thank you that's what it is, I've when I've been using in capturing footage, I was I was bouncing a lot back and forth between TSR and FXAA and I just found that FSA fxia creates less artifacts, because that's it's still going to be an issue in TSR when you're using it it's still gonna be like artifacting, there's a couple of instances where if you have like you know the outline around containers and stuff like that if you're very close to objects and you have TSR like a high amount of TSR like if you're running say 60 of the screen or whatever and you're moving the camera around sporadically there's going to be like white lines all over the screen which I find a bit annoying, there's also stuff with the Sky Box I don't know if that's something we need to work more on like supporting wise but same thing if you look back and forth in the sky the clouds look really strange and stuff like that, so so yeah it a lot of times when I've used FXAA I've I've found to get better results than using TSR but I think whenever it comes to this kind of stuff in general it depends on the circumstance so like maybe in some some cases FXAA is better and in some cases trsr is better at other ways depending on situation and that's really how it is with, a lot of these type of, any rendering technique really, but yeah I don't remember which ones we're going to support at the moment because it's not here in the, oh I've just found in the notes here it is, I think it's CSR nfxaa there might be support for what's the the the we have a default one right now that's still going to be there of course but now there are more options for anti-aliasing essentially, cool I think we're gonna move on here unless there's any specific questions about this that I haven't brought up, I'm getting a little bit of support here like there's a pain in the asset set of FSR dlss yes, I don't think if I'm pretty sure we had to do something to get TSR working with the game because we it's still the issue you still need to like if you have moving meshes you need to do something special with them to be able to get them to render properly than TSR so there's been a bit of, work but into that

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, ta can have nasty Go sing and blurs yeah so that that's the thing because I found better I found well at least in the situations when I was testing I found better support like I found it to look better with FXAA than TAA which shouldn't be the case it should be the other around, so it's like it's faster and it looks better at least when I was testing maybe I needed to run around more factories and stuff because I was mostly running around in the environment but, yeah yeah sea fighting is nothing it doesn't has nothing to do with it although you can if there can be circumstances where when there's a lot of Z fighting in you and you're upscaling it, the sea fighting is going to be less pronounced when the well it depends because it depend on angle and stuff like that the Cami cases where Z fighting is less pronounced in lower resolutions and then you're upscaling that, but you might instead end up with a lot more artifacting, so it might look you know it it's like up for debate whether it looks better or not, but yeah cool let's move on, because we're